Appreciate your comments, Ed, Ed, your note rings alarm bells for me. Will I need to open an Estate Account? And has instructed the last lawyer to not do anything even though he's the one who sent it without tracking by regular mail. Also consider the fact that when a lawyer holds funds in trust, the interest earned on the funds is paid to the Law Foundation and not to clients. If he will not clean it up voluntarily, you might consider asking the court to remove him. As far as the bank is concerned, your father's account is still HIS account and not an estate account until the probate has come through. If they won't let you do it your way (which happens to be the correct way) then take all the funds out and put them in a different bank.Lynne. I needed 2 estate accounts, one in C$ and one in US$. My father was a street person, so they helped to budget his money. If you go to the bank that cashed out her account to you, they may agree to cash it, simply because they know you, and they know that you are the executor. Unfortunately, what you are trying to do is completely against all estate law, which is based on the documents that exist, not the documents that might have existed or could have existed.Your father left the RRSP beneficiary form with named beneficiaries. My context for the question was a little different: an estate account with two trustees specified in the will who are to pay bills for someone in a house who is not being given direct access to the money. An Estate account is a different kind of account - it is a new account opened after someone has passed away, into which the Executor deposits the deceased person's money, from which the Executor pays the deceased person's debts and bills, and from which the Executor ultimately distributes funds to . There is another 400,000.00 in GIC's and a house in my father's name. As his mother I took care of his arrangements and the funeral home applied for CPP. Once you are proven to be the executor, the bank has no control over what you do with the money because they bear no liability. He did not leave a will. My Dad just died and he had 2 bank accounts with myself as co-owner with right of survivorship. If not, you might try escalating your request up through the bank's channels until you find someone willing to actually make the simple change. I am both executor of her "estate", as well as POA and sole beneficiary. I can see from the way you've presented your question that you believe the risk of anything or anyone popping up is pretty low. Could I be charged with fraud?Thank you for your blog BTW, it's been very informative and helpful. In fact, it's standard. Old thread/comments but, RBC did for me, but I was a customer of theirs for 40+ years. The bank has frozen any access to these accounts until a declaration form is received at the branch for me too sign. One is that the two of you work it out between you. She was living with me and we have a joint bank account. Real Estate in Ontario, such as a house, condo, apartment or cottage, in the name of the deceased or as tenants in common. I advised my husband to find another bank, because after I talked to the TD Manager, wanting to understand what they told him, the branch manager talked over me too. Death benefits are administered by the federal government. My father also had very little but there is a car in his name To anonymous July 8/19: The bank might allow that or they may require you to close the joint account and open an estate account. This is an on-going business with on-going income and bills that need to be paid. One employee actually told the two executors to deposit into the account my mother in law held joint with the one vs opening a new one. I am sole trustee on an estate, appointed by Superiour Court (Ontario). It should take 10 minutes if you have the proper paperwork, and it sounds as if you do. Estate planning, wills and dealing with death Making a will, planning your estate, powers of attorney and what to do following a death. It never works when people try to make square pegs fit into round holes by using financial instruments and legal documents to do things they were never meant to do.Anyway, enough lecture. Open an account online in about 20 minutes or apply in-branch. Hi Linda,The cheque should be written to you as executor, as the lawyer has suggested. Instead of avoiding the probate fee, not only does the account still go into the estate, but you may also have to pay for a lawsuit to determine your mother's intention in making the account joint. On the schedules there are categories. On July 21, I escalated my complaint to that bank's ombudsman. TD gave him such a hard time. I now have everything else to do with her estate completed except her final income tax return, but that's underway and I know within a few thousand dollars what that liability will be. What is my recourse as an executor? Per the CRA website a T4RRSP/T4LIF/T4RRIF should be issued showing fair market value on date of deat, and interest earned from DOD until the end of the year. This bit about the banks not allowing executors to open an estate account until probate has been granted is relatively new, and only works for the bank. No. Hope this not too confusing. You can't just add your name to an existing account, as that would suggest that your sister is alive and you two are joint owners, which obviously cannot be the case.This is the only thing that makes sense to me in the context of your question. bank accounts (includes foreign banks) Shares, bonds, trust units, options, mutual funds, TFSAs, RRSPs, RRIFs vehicles such as cars, trucks, boats, motorcycles, trailers situated in or outside Ontario goods or material Keep in mind though that when you present your accounting to the beneficiaries at the end of the estate, your expenses must show up there. They also told me that it doesn't matter if the will states that the funds are to be split between myself and 3 kids, that because they have it listed on their system that only the kids are beneficeries, that they have to go by that. Will i need a letter of administration to open an estate account or will my bank let me sign a letter of indemnity? An estate account is a temporary bank account that holds an estate's money. I would like to reference your site to them. On to your question. Can I open an estate account and deposit his cheque into it. I am the executor or the estate and the sole beneficiary of the will. but i have a tax refund cheque payable to the estate of xxxxx. Without more facts, I don't know for sure that this is what they are getting at, but there should be no bank policy to say an executor must wait 6 months. By the way, I checked out your site and it's really unique and interesting.Lynne, Is this a special category of account at the bank or can one just open a regular bank account with the name on the account as you've described above. I am an executor of my mother's will. If so, it will pose quite a hardship on her as a student. I've heard and seen horror stories from every bank and credit union.Note that I'm not talking about the trust company part of the banks. I know this because I spent 7 years at Scotiabank doing whatever I could to help out the front line staff dealing with estates. It's possible to use the lawyer's trust account, but that's not usually the most efficient way because, as you say, you have to pay the lawyer each time he/she does something with the account. It is a normal bank account that is opened in the name of the deceased person's estate. Earn a $300 welcome bonus with a new bank account 2. While I find this admirable in spirit, I am concerned as an executor whether executors can in fact make gifts that are not specifically covered in the will, especially as there are other residual beneficiaries involved. Hi Lynne,I have a question. Everything else of my husbands, all accounts, homes,, RRSP's etc. I also have been told that I will have to get the estate value to pay the Estate Death tax for probate at the same time as this application for estate trustee goes. Other banks are also refusing to open estate accounts. We represent both estate trustees and beneficiaries deal with this crucial part of the estate administration process. What if there was a mortgage on the property (there isn't). The bank will simply remove the parent's name from the account upon receiving proof of death, leaving the surviving account holder with full access to and legal ownership of the account. All debts of the estate have been paid. I would like to make a full distribution of the estate proceeds without waiting for her 2018 taxes to be filed next year. Not every will is probated, and the banks are well aware of that, particularly if some of your joint assets were held there. It's not because it's an investment account, but because of the value.Lynne. Once everything is in order - do the beneficiaries receive there funds retroactively from date of loved ones death? Mom's bank had temporarily closed here in this town due to the Covid-19 so I would have to go to the City talk to them in the branch. Hi Lynne,My mother passed away in Aug 2018. Have you taken the estate paperwork to the bank with the cheque? Those people actually DO know their way around estates really well. All he did was tell the banks that she had terminal cancer,(one bank employee stated she was told, he was consolidating my mother's assets, she called their lawyer, who told them it was okay to give him the money) and they released the money, prior to her death. I asked if i can close the account and open one that says Sara Smith, Administrator of the Estate of Jane Doe and they said no. This account is available for all youth under 18 years of age. All of the banks are telling me I need to wait for probate, and to process the transactions through our own accounts and keep detailed records. Should I be raising cane at TD? Once the funeral arrangements have been made and all interested parties informed of the death, one of the first things the executor must do is deal with the bank accounts of the deceased: Finding out what banks, credit card companies, and other financial institutions the deceased dealt with, notifying them that you are the executor, and determining the details of assets in all accounts. Your mother's money wasn't safe because your brother is a crook. However, this doesn't mean that property and assets left to heirs will not be taxed. Canadian Western Bank (CWB) is the only full-service bank in Canada with a strategic focus to meet the unique financial needs of businesses and their owners. This risk is eliminated (for the bank) by the probate process. This might be repairing and restoring or it might not. In particular, the bit about being listed as executor per CRA. The house just had a major fire and two of the executors want to sell the house as is (with the fire damage), settle with the insurance company and distribute the settlement proceeds as part of the estate. Once the letter of probate has been granted and presented to the bank where the estate account has been set up, does the bank have any further right to "approve" payments coming out of the estate account. However, you can call and enquire if you don't want to make a special appointment with a banking representative. Yes, you can, assuming you've already paid all estate debts and liabilities.Lynne. He had a will and I am his sole beneficiary. I am an executor of the will, so I would obviously send these funds back to our Mom, but what are the tax implications of this? It's quite possible that they will insist on probate. I am the sole executor and beneficiary of my deceased husband. . I guess my question is do they have the right to not release the money once probate has been granted? Can you confirm when I take the tax bill to the bank it can be paid from his estate. Hi Bob,I would be very surprised if the bank did not allow you to sign a letter of indemnity under the circumstances. BMO Business Builder 1 Monthly Fees: $22.50 Transactions: 35 free transactions per month | Unlimited Moneris transactions Monthly Deposits: $2,500 cash deposits How To Sign Up: Link However, an executor does have the right to use whatever bank he or she chooses, and it makes sense to go where you feel comfortable and have received good service. All the risk of the account falls on the executor, not on the bank. They will not liquidate any account of any kind worth $500,000 without either probate or Letters of Administration. How many times do I hear that in a week? I don't want to put any money through my personal bank account as I want to be able to keep organized records for when I do the final payout. Do they have this right? The bank was very helpful ,CIBC, in not having me set up an estate account (funds in account under $3000) as I had a joint account due to his dementia where his money went in and his bills came out of. Do I have to go open an estate account for,this one cheque. It's under $75,000. The cheque isn't written to you or to your husband, which is why it cannot be deposited. The majority of elder financial abuse is done by the elder's kids.The police can't really do much because the power of attorney gave your brother the right to access the money. Give the cheques to that person. Doing otherwise is theft or fraud.Lynne. My mother died in Feb 2017 and her account was at RBC. Also, if there are two beneficiaries, neither is a "sole" beneficiary, since "sole" means "one". An executor can never use estate funds for personal spending. The banks set their own limits on how much they are willing to risk without obtaining probate.Lynne. It also excludes financial accounts that already have a beneficiary designated. Unbelievable! Ask them to pay the bill from his chequing account. Their job is to hand over the account once probate has been granted. You probably will not need to go through Letters of Administration just for one vehicle (depends on various factors).Lynne. Hi,I'd like to know if it is absolutely required for an estate account to be made.My grandmother passed away and there are only two beneficiaries, my mother and I. Does the annual audit of accounts reflect this inaction? Do I actually need any sort of approval? There could be a problem with it, or there could be a newer one, or for some other reason this might not be a good will. I have since gone to CIBC and they had no issue with helping me without probate. In the next breath the employee told the other executor, the old account is now yours and you can take the Money and run. Financial institution (Questrade) refuses to do so and claims this is against the law (True?). The bank now says I have to wait 6 months before disbursing to beneficiaries. My mother's will has her 3 children as executors. Please don't tell me you just walked away and left the estate alone for 5 months! If there is not enough and you have to take funds out of the sale of the house, then you have a couple of choices. Everything has been done for the estate. I went into the bank again and asked to see her but she was in a meeting so another representative took my name and number. Sorry.my question is actually can I deposit this cheque to my account or cash it? Probate is slow because her state pension came from UK along with a small occupational pension. That sounds wrong to me. No, not that I know of. Through the firm that handled my mothers taxes we have filed and received a refund for her 2017 taxes. Received his last Canada Pension cheque, issued in the month of his passing but am unable to cash it. 8. But the underlying question is -- what to do with this situation of having no will. Or, if the primary account holder of your joint bank account has recently passed away, we can assist you in determining your entitlement, if any, to the account assets. CIBC opened an Estate account on my application based on my provision to them of the notarized Court Appointment. to the bank and they should open the account with no problem. Lynne- Using the example from Marsha: Can the account have links to automatic bill payments with registered companies, so all three trustees don't need to be in person to pay every single bill? (It's possible to open up a separate trust account for a single estate so that interest can be earned but this seems like a lot of work when the bank can just do that for you directly).Bottom line is that for most clients most of the time, using a bank account directly is the best choice. Apparently the estate wing of the bank does not inform the local branch where the papers were scanned if there is a problem. One lawyer told my mother, that she had a case against the three banks, but of course she was dying and had no money except for her pension, which he took, convincing her he had made a deal for my brother to return the money, and pay thousands in legal fees, to the lawyer. slips. Practical, real-world information about wills, estates, inheritance, executors, and elder law in Canada, Great article. Estate Planning. Do I have any rights to see this paperwork? After the death benefit from CPP was deposited, I as the executor, got them to make a money order for each of the 4 children (self included) to divide estate funds up and closed the joint account. The estate is valued under 20000 dollars so we are not applying for probate. Use your account to receive deposits and your debit card to make everyday business purchases. It must be a policy that TD has established. If they still won't comply, you will probably have to hire a lawyer to write a letter to them for you.Lynne. at which point the funds will go to Estate. My sister and I were listed as co-executors and my sister has since renounced her position as executor (legally documented with the lawyer that held my mothers will). I know this is an old topic, but I have a question. No probate is required. Hi Lynne, I had POA for my mum, who had dementia. However, that is none of the bank's business. Right now she acts as though she is doing me a "favour" but trying to replace the bank draft but takes on responsibility at all and definitely refuses to sign it telling the bank excuses but telling me she will not sign her life away. Lynne. Make sure you have provided everything they asked for. I suggest you read the 2007 Supreme Court of Canada cases called Pecore and Saylor. The bank has an account for which there is no online access? Tell him in advance that you are coming in to collect a cheque for the full amount of funds and you expect it to be ready. As well I received a cheque from a class action (veterans affairs). Neither of those situations is ideal, but you can only work with the situation you're in.Lynne. An estate account is a financial tool used to manage the estate of a decedent. No spouse. This assumes there is enough in the account, of course. How can he sign papers, cheques if he is not physically able to do so? The duty of the executors is to maximize the estate as best they can. HelloMy dad passed away in February and had little to no assets as he lived in a care facility. It clearly names me as the Estate Trustee. They did have one joint account. I have 2 brothers and we were all named beneficiaries. No, an executor absolutely should not deposit money into his personal account. I'm in Alberta. Prior to Mom passing away I went to the Mom's bank and spoke to a representative who had me sign a doc so that it would be on file that I had her Enduring Power of Attorney. Is the tax specialist you mentioned willing to write to the bankers directly and request the change be made? I'm in Ontario, btw. I am in a similar situation with no will for my deceased father. The banks have always agreed to this (with only one exception) because the funds aren't going to the executor or anyone else besides the court. She had one (nonjoint) bank account, a TFSA which had some money in it. If you don't get the funds that way, bump the issue up the line through the bank channels as a complaint.Lynne. Take the will, a copy of the death certificate (or funeral director's statement) and your I.D. If you're looking for a way to speed up the process, I think you'll end up talking to the manager of trust first, and if necessary, kicking it further up the channels. My dad had no will, no spouse and i am his only child. I have having some real tough issues with TD Bank. CIBC requested personal ID documentation for each and every beneficiary on the account which I supplied although I was hesitant to believe the Money Laundering Act actually requires it. They will insist on probate of his arrangements and the funeral home applied for CPP beneficiary! Were all named beneficiaries confirm when i take the will with me and we were all named.! Do n't tell me you just walked away and left the estate paperwork to the bankers directly and the! 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